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Welcome to Fractal Forums > Fractal Software > 3D Fractal Generation > Mandelbulb 3d > feature request > Color sliders on mandelbulb 3d
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Author Topic: Color sliders on mandelbulb 3d  (Read 7239 times)
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bib
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« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2012, 11:01:58 AM »
I'm not enough expert in formulas, but that *might* be possible in M3D by decomposing the Mandelbox formula using basic functions like _planeFold (where you can change the normals (bulber rotbox style), _sphereinv (or some other formula involving a spherical condition, not sure however if it's the same as what Tglad called "ballfold"), _addC, and probably _CondItcountR as Fo1 for the test (planefoldfold vs sphereinv depending on the current radius)...
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taurus
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« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2012, 04:28:29 PM »
might be - might not be. the motivation to try with such effort, when you have a readymade solution on your desk is almost zero. the main reason for this is anyhow not to reproduce my mandelbulbers in m3d, i'd like to see, if i can make usable hybrids out of them. Hybridisation in mandelbulber is in general no match to m3d and additionally plane-rotation is ignored in hybrids.
so if darkbeam implements it in m3d - cool, i'll take it. if not it's ok too - i'll never have to fear copetitive rotboxes from m3d  wink
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DarkBeam
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« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2012, 04:37:49 PM »
Quote from: Jesse on August 04, 2012, 11:03:44 PM
IIRC MBulber is rotating at the boxfold planes, whereas M3d rotations are between the main iteration of Abox.. in front of the boxfold.

Maybe a challenge for Luca to do make a Marczak RotBox formula?  wink

Yeah, however.  Hope i could save some time...  A Beer Cup

I looked; he seems to rotate before scaling & adding C, it can be reproduced with relative ease maybe. cheesy
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DarkBeam
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« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2012, 04:43:46 PM »
Can anybody check if this works like Mandelbulber;


Mandelbulb3Dv18{
b.....S....O/...w....2....ErPEUY.6EB.zY1wp1B7a6EvyAXoPLO8.Q5GGaO6fZ/.1NHepLPlO/k
................................UiboVK/hEz1........Y./..................y.2...wD
...Uz.....E1..../MU//.....kM/...M2....E3.....YFxF5lUm3tD/..........m/dkpXm1....U
z.....kD12../..........wz..................................u1....y1...sD...../..
.z1...sDdIV9XEXqEyX1XrvyIUNbyqHieJ7nF6rjxwF7vfDhGxf0aEJ7pcBYz6sgMHX5o3rjBmsu6r0R
lxHG.lHWx4VQzU0C8cQ35/tD......I5..............sD.6....sD..E.....................
.............oAnAt1...sD....z.rbp9.2UKj.k0Ox0.Jcp9.wVKj.E8Ox0.ncp9......S....k1.
..................kz.wzzz1.U..6.P....U5...EB....m....c3....F....6/...I1.....SF52
...U.qFG9yzb2zzzRYoWzz7lz16.pc..zXCc..kvrEtMc7xD4ocyFE0ujz1..........2.28.kFrA0.
.Ub96aAIVz9.1se7Umvxz0........../EU0.wzzz1...........s/...................E.2c..
zzzz.............0...................2./8.kzzzD............8....................
/EU0.wzzz1...................................2CcN/UvNPcveeWCNq0.yRiibHJJUk1f..XR
SvBmx3CcN/UvNPcvQsLsUa3.ibhVi1bTV1OK.sSq4uCly3CcN/UvNPcvMwLsUa3.ibhVinqTV1OK.sSq
4uCkz3CcN/UvNPcv..EsUa3feeWCNqGQIJ36wk8EwyLsUa3f................................
E....E....E.....I....6....kL/pKMuZaPb7oPs/UQ..........................k/4k.1A...
...................wz.........yD................................................
................................................................................
.....................2.....3....1....wZIjFLMoJ4.................................
4MU/............................................................................
................................................................................
................................/....E/...E.....TBpMVlKOiR4.....................
..........................................2.....................................
................................................................................
..........................................E.....I....A....kLVF4N1/..............
...................................................wz.........zD........kz1.....
................................................................................
........................................................}


 wink
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taurus
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« Reply #19 on: August 07, 2012, 07:52:58 PM »
hm, do i need additional formulas (sorry just downloaded 1.82 and left it untouched)?
looks like a scale 2 box without rotation and i can't add a second scaling in bulber (add c is at 1 by default in fractal tab). just for fun inserted a proven parameter of mandelbulber in your hybrid (rotate 11,5,7 scale -1.2 rest default) in all three possibilities
tab 1 scale 1, tab 3 scale -1.2 rotate as mentioned
tab 1 scale -1.2, tab 3 scale 2 rotate as mentioned
tab 1 scale -1.2, tab 3 scale -1.2 rotate as mentioned
no noticable similarity

* xchange.jpg (240.86 KB, 1340x978 - viewed 346 times.)
« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 08:04:21 PM by taurus66 » Logged
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taurus
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« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2012, 07:56:18 PM »
the previously mentioned parameters should look like:

* xchange.jpg (154.04 KB, 800x400 - viewed 304 times.)
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Jesse
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« Reply #21 on: August 07, 2012, 08:54:35 PM »
Looks like MBulber got a similar rotation like the usual alternating formula combination in M3d, so your parameters looks a bit like this:
Code:
Mandelbulb3Dv18{
b.....S....O/...22...2.....HlwYvfFsyzUkD.rWTj10EouoDOVz6sznOMz5KT/zyzKbiH1K9f8.E
................................k9u3hSJ3O.2........Y./..................y.2...wD
...Uz.........../M.0/.....kR/...YE....E3.....wIdq0/aMNoD/..........m/dkpXm1....U
z.....kD12../..........wz..................................u1....y1...sD...../..
.z1...sDgVn83TYh2xPs58qx8k7AzmVaqumxP9kDcYfx.7m4QwP5dqfsx3iBz.UB4.9/T9oDtLUmudtR
iwfeNioBEtIEzgJ..O5fFTnj......ov..............sD.6....PE..E.....................
.............oAnAt1...sD....z.YSXA.suBm..ir61.0TXA.kwBm.Upr61.UTXA......00...k1.
.....AQxcz1.......kz.wzzz5.U..6.P....M2...EB....m....c3...E9....z....I1.....SN52
...U.W1KEyzlciszsU3YzTAe906.oc..zzSi...MarH7iXyD4oa4dabdnz1..........2E28.UQgk0.
.wUmc2beYz1.dA8E5Exwz0........../.V0.sXTL0..SQcDqMitzu/BQKxV62zD..........E.2c..
zzzz.............0...................2./8.kzzzD............8....................
/EU0.wzzz1...................................wzz.0.E./2EzzFAZq/../2E.tzDOQp1..2E
./IzTxzz.0.E./2EQsrzz16../2E./bTzzDU..2E./2lyxzz.0.E./2EMwrzz16../2E.lqTzzDU..2E
./2kzxzz.0.E./2E...cU08czz/cU08cyz1cU08cxz3cU08c................................
E....6....E.....I....A....kLGx4RVFLN.................................MU/4.......
..................U7./.......E/E........Q.2.....................................
................................................................................
.....................2...../....1....2IPVdLOiR460x4S.65.........................
.Qk0.................AnAnAnAnAzj........Uz1........wz...........................
................................................................................
................................}


There might be slight differences in how the rotations are performed.

You only have to increase the maximum iterations because 60 is not enough for a scale near to +/-1.
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taurus
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« Reply #22 on: August 07, 2012, 10:25:33 PM »
Quote from: Jesse on August 07, 2012, 08:54:35 PM

You only have to increase the maximum iterations because 60 is not enough for a scale near to +/-1.


oh no, how embarassing.  embarrass it seems to be that simple. there are slight differences, especially when getting closer, but this is much better, than everything i ever tried before! you just prooved a previous assumption in this thread - i am too stupid...  sad max iters are allways at 250 in bulber by default and the shattering conclusion is, that i didn't tranlate 1 on 1... i still can't believe. i often change max iters in mandelbulber to tune iteration fog before switching it on (especially around 40-60), but i never saw the similarity to my fruitless attempts in m3d.

the only positive thing for me is, the reason i rarely see real challenging rotboxes in m3d gallery (in older images as well) is not, that tey are hard to make...

thanks for opening my eyes and thanks for the effort - to both of you!  Cantor Dance

btw. you have a hint, how to translate m3d coordinates to cartesian? don't hesitate to use math notations (but no program code), i'm not so bad at it, as it might look here grin
« Last Edit: August 07, 2012, 10:36:01 PM by taurus66 » Logged
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DarkBeam
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« Reply #23 on: August 07, 2012, 10:33:46 PM »
Do not know the answer!
Mandelbulber has its systems for rots, he makes the hypotesis...
Rotxyz(v) := rotx(roty(rotz(v)))

instead jesse uses a matrix. It must be faster wink
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taurus
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« Reply #24 on: August 07, 2012, 11:29:14 PM »
Quote from: DarkBeam on August 07, 2012, 10:33:46 PM
Mandelbulber has its systems for rots

was asking for a point in space, direction is secondary. but i've got a practical solution. >julia>get values from image>x,y,z. what's what i'll see.
cad pros are simple minds grin
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DarkBeam
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« Reply #25 on: August 08, 2012, 11:03:06 AM »
Modified Jesse's parameter to get more close to your request (rotate BEFORE adding c, so it should be the same as Buddhis), look if it's good;

Mandelbulb3Dv18{
b.....S....O/...S3...2.............6.1.......s3E................................
........................................kz1........Y./..................y.2...wD
...Uz.....k1..../M.0/.....Eb....Q5....E3.....omEQgisq6rD/..........m/dkpXm1....U
z.....kD12../..............................................u1....y1...sD...../..
.z1...sD2Rw3Oc.cazXAWreAEZc2zSWyooeAVOyjn01OKX4.UzHltH0E52etzMoB5uO/yzxDRvxzRX4.
UznjaqEWp.etz4Of4lq8..yD......oA..............sD.6....PE..E.0...................
.............oAnAt1...sD....z.rbp9.2UKj.k0Ox0.Jcp9.wVKj.E8Ox0.ncp9......y....k1.
.....AQxcz1.......kz.wzzz5.U..6.P....M2...EB....m....c3...E9....z....I1.....SN52
...U.W1KEyzlciszsU3YzTAe906.oc..zzSi...MarH7iXyD4oa4dabdnz1..........2E28.UQgk0.
.wUmc2beYz1.dA8E5Exwz0........../.V0.sXTL0..SQcDqMitzu/BQKxV62zD..........E.2c..
zzzz.............0...................2./8.kzzzD............8....................
/EU0.wzzz1...................................wzz.0.E./2EzzFAZq/../2E.tzDOQp1..2E
./IzTxzz.0.E./2EQsrzz16../2E./bTzzDU..2E./2lyxzz.0.E./2EMwrzz16../2E.lqTzzDU..2E
./2kzxzz.0.E./2E...cU08czz/cU08cyz1cU08cxz3cU08c................................
E....A....E.....I....6....kL/pKMuZaPb7oPs/UQ..........................k/9.......
..........kAnAnAnAnwz0........yD........kz1.....................................
................................................................................
.....................2.....3....1....wZIjFLMoJ4.................................
4MU/.........................M0E........I.2........5./..........................
................................................................................
................................/....E/...k.....T34NYB2.g34RZ/..................
........................................kz1........wz.........zD................
................................................................................
............................................}
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taurus
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« Reply #26 on: August 08, 2012, 12:55:06 PM »
Quote from: DarkBeam on August 08, 2012, 11:03:06 AM
Modified Jesse's parameter to get more close to your request (rotate BEFORE adding c, so it should be the same as Buddhis), look if it's good;


cool, thanks! i'll have a look when i'm back from work.
after the shock about my beginner mistake was gone, yesterday, i had a closer look at jesse's params and my first attempts from last year (i took a lenord param as base back then, so they have correct maxtiter value). the differences seem to increase, the higher the zoom stage is (still got probs to get there in m3d). as my evenings are busy, i don't know, when i can do a detailed comparison. so be a bit patient - i will report...
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« Reply #27 on: August 09, 2012, 06:12:01 AM »
with the "julia mode measurement tool" i was able to inentify particular corners, without visual investigation. images are:
mandelbulber,  luca1
luca2, jesse

at first glance they are quite similar (except direction of axis) and i can't see differences in m3d versions. at a zoom of about 40000 i saw significant differences between mandelbulber and luca2 parameter (no image yet). need more time to investigate. stay tuned...

Code:
Mandelbulb3Dv18{
b.....S....O/...z1...2....Egu52/eY7..fZbyL1DAnyjclQmLqnO..Yux8FZ2pszzGSv1f2ne..k
................................lFhMaeEYG/2........Y./.................U4/2...wD
...Uz.....kB..../Q.0/.....EV/...48....E5.....EIpJ.LbYxkD/Q.........m/dkpXm1....U
z.....kD12../..............................................u1....y1...sD...../..
.z1...sDGlixMelzov9oCNpzv/JoyGQpN21c/qkjMXZgJ1mdgv9h2b7f/2X1z4qNtoeUBAiDYpyDA67h
Aw9Dzb7UnO8wyox6pr6VoAjD......IH....P.........sD.6....PE2.E.0.jKk5ETMxzDIgHQphg7
..gomVHTsjtzzqAnAt1...sD....z.rbJA.2UKl.k0O31.JcJA.wVKl.E8O31.ncJA......6/...k1.
.....AQxcz1.......kz.wzzz5.U..6.P....M2...EB....m....c3...E9....z....I1.....SN52
...U.W1KEyzlciszsU3YzTAe906.2c..zzSi...MarH7iXyD4oa4dabdnz1..........2E28.UQgk0.
.wUmc2beYz1.dA8E5Exwz0........../.V0.sXTL0..SQcDqMitzu/BQKxV62zD..........E.2c..
zzzz.............0...................2./8.kzzzD............8....................
/EU0.wzzz1...................................wzz.0.E./2EBG0U.yD../2E.BX9lIO5..2E
./IkNxDU.0.E./2E4krzz16../2E.hCTzzDU..2E./IBxxzz.0.E./2Exsrzz16../2E.hlTzzDU..2E
./ILzxzz.0.E./2E...cU08czz/cU08cyz1cU08cxz3cU08c................................
E....A....E.....I....6....kL/pKMuZaPb7oPs/UQ..........................k/4.......
..........kAnAnAnAnwz0........yD........kz1.....................................
................................................................................
.....................2.....3....1....wZIjFLMoJ4.................................
4MU/.........................M0E........I.2........5./..........................
................................................................................
................................/....E/...k.....T34NYB2.g34RZ/..................
........................................kz1........wz.........zD................
................................................................................
............................................}

* comparison.jpg (219.79 KB, 960x720 - viewed 389 times.)
« Last Edit: August 09, 2012, 06:19:59 AM by taurus66 » Logged
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DarkBeam
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« Reply #28 on: August 09, 2012, 09:33:00 AM »
Excellent then. grin

Checking again an old formula I made, the one with custom inversion center, I noticed it was totally wrong, it added a value instead of moving the center and restoring it back.  sad So! I want to release an updated one that supports rotation too, and if I can, rotatable fold planes. Hoping my brain does not explode. rolling on floor laughing
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« Reply #29 on: August 09, 2012, 01:26:09 PM »
btw. made a little benchmark with theese images, to verify the often considered speed lack of mandelbulber. in m3d i activated hard shadows and deao to match mandelbulbers minimal quality settings.
results @ 480x360:
m3d   17s (handstopped)
bulber 18s (stopped by mandelbulber)

but i have to admit, that the mandelbox is the fastest formula in mandelbulber. effects like map based ao, volumetric light or iteration fog would surely increase this time to several minutes. not to mention any kind of hybrid.
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