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chaos_crystal
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« on: March 03, 2011, 06:55:56 AM » |
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I hope I'm on the right part of the forum for questions like this, if not, please feel free to move this post... I'm still confused about MB3D. The deviantART tut is beginning to make more sense, but my main problem right now is Julia numbers. The author just tells about the X, Y, and Z settings, but in version 1631 we've got Zstart, Zmid, and Zend, and also X mid, and Y mid. So I don't understand which ones correspond with his directions, which definitely sound different in this part of the tut. Maybe he means the X, Y and Z under the Cutting tab? I tried those and nothing happened... Also the DE accuracy default is supposedly 8. All I see is a "DE stop" but nothing that says "accuracy." And the default there seems to be point-8 rather than a full 8. Every time I try to change that to an 8, it just reverts back. MB3d doesn't always like my clumsy choices, half the time I get a black screen...  |
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I conceived and developed a new geometry of nature and implemented its use in a number of diverse fields. It describes many of the irregular and fragmented patterns around us, and leads to full-fledged theories, by identifying a family of shapes I call fractals.
— Benoit Mandelbrot
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lenord
Fractal Bachius
Posts: 611
No Matter where you go there you are
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« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2011, 07:36:12 AM » |
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First I'd be using Version 1694 and not an old version but that's up to you.
The Julia set numbers are set on the "Julia Mode" tab, enter whatever you want for X-Y-Z or click Insert Mid Values.
There are presets that change automatically for Preview, Mid and High resolution Renders, I'd stick with the default settings for each till you are used to the program they are pretty acceptable. With exception for the Stepwidth Limiter, put it at 0.1 and raystep multiplier (The lower the more accurale and the longer the render) .09 is Hires default. After you get familiar with it then start playing with Raystep Multiplier and Stepcount which is what pretty much determines accuracy. Until you get a good feel for what's going on I wouldn't mess with DE Stop
Cutting X-Y-Z do just that, Cut the Box/Bulb along those axis
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chaos_crystal
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« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2011, 05:14:00 AM » |
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LEN tipped me about the newest version. I didn't know it was out there or where to find it, but he linked me to it on the forum here. (Thanx again, Len!) So now I have that. I opened it and began to play a bit (since I only had a few minutes but I thought 'what the hey, I'll give it a go'), brought out a parameter file and in only a few minutes came up with a fractal image....it was ugly and had a problem at the top edge, so I didn't save it... But it's a start! Now to dig into the newly acquired tutorial sometime during the weekend...  |
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I conceived and developed a new geometry of nature and implemented its use in a number of diverse fields. It describes many of the irregular and fragmented patterns around us, and leads to full-fledged theories, by identifying a family of shapes I call fractals.
— Benoit Mandelbrot
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tomot
Iterator
Posts: 179
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« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2011, 04:55:19 PM » |
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a little bit more related help: I come at this subject from an architectural background. Many programs such as MAX, Cinema 4D, Vue 9, SketchUp, AutoCad, to name just a few I have used in the past, all start with Windowing an object in standard orientations based on Orthographic projections. Plan, Right side, Left Side, & Isometric views. for example: if I wanted to look at the default bulb from the top, btm, right or left side, is a a quick way to select such a setting?  |
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Sockratease
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« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2011, 06:37:35 PM » |
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a little bit more related help: I come at this subject from an architectural background. Many programs such as MAX, Cinema 4D, Vue 9, SketchUp, AutoCad, to name just a few I have used in the past, all start with Windowing an object in standard orientations based on Orthographic projections. Plan, Right side, Left Side, & Isometric views. for example: if I wanted to look at the default bulb from the top, btm, right or left side, is a a quick way to select such a setting? Sort of... What I do is set the number for the main window rotation to 90 degrees instead of the default whatever low number it is, thus:  This still requires recalculation, but if you use the 3D Navigator and send the view there it is much faster. Or even the newly implemented "calc" button for a very rough idea. Remember; these things are not 3D Objects. There is no real mesh to speak of, so analogies to 3D Software like Carrara and those you mentioned is not going to be a good idea. It operates on an entirely other level. |
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Life is complex - It has real and imaginary components. The All New Fractal Forums is now in Public Beta Testing! Visit FractalForums.org and check it out! |
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lenord
Fractal Bachius
Posts: 611
No Matter where you go there you are
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« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2011, 09:13:05 PM » |
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You can relate it to a CAD system from the point that unlike most 3D apps the Camera Never moves only the object you are looking at moves. Zoomed out and large rotations are observable, Zoomed in and large rotations will put you somewhere else completely. No matter whether it's and existing Param or a fresh Box/Bulb I'd start from Reset Pos/Zoom and Rotate 45s until I found something interesting then Zoom on it. With a lot of the now existing Params I reset Pos/Zoom and do an immediate 50 or 100 Zoom and go from there, depends on what you're looking for.
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chaos_crystal
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« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2011, 05:23:33 AM » |
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Sock's comments and observations tempted me to go ahead and ask this Q. under my own subject line  I'm learning a bit more how to get on in MB3D (thanx in part to Len's tutorial). I am learning how to use the navigator, it is fairly easy. BUT...when I hit on something I sorta liked (reminded me of a "Where's Waldo?" with a dragon hiding in a garden of broccoli, but hey, I'm new ) I tried to send the Nav settings back on to the main screen, then I hit the Calculator button...but I didn't get quite the same image I had worked up on the Navigator screen. I fiddled around with the ambient shadow, etc. but it wasn't coming out the same... Why would this happen? An early effort (not great, but I did save that one) did come out the same when I moved the settings back to the main screen... |
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I conceived and developed a new geometry of nature and implemented its use in a number of diverse fields. It describes many of the irregular and fragmented patterns around us, and leads to full-fledged theories, by identifying a family of shapes I call fractals.
— Benoit Mandelbrot
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Sockratease
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« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2011, 11:24:29 AM » |
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Sock's comments and observations tempted me to go ahead and ask this Q. under my own subject line I'm learning a bit more how to get on in MB3D (thanx in part to Len's tutorial). I am learning how to use the navigator, it is fairly easy. BUT...when I hit on something I sorta liked (reminded me of a "Where's Waldo?" with a dragon hiding in a garden of broccoli, but hey, I'm new ) I tried to send the Nav settings back on to the main screen, then I hit the Calculator button...but I didn't get quite the same image I had worked up on the Navigator screen. I fiddled around with the ambient shadow, etc. but it wasn't coming out the same... Why would this happen? An early effort (not great, but I did save that one) did come out the same when I moved the settings back to the main screen... What'd I say? Anyway; There is always going to be a big difference between the way things look in the navigator and in the main window. If I recall correctly, they use 2 totally different render engines and the navigator's is optimized for speed, while the main window is optimized for detail - or something like that. I just remember reading someplace that they are different and to get the main window to duplicate exactly what you see in the navigator is not always easy (usually lots of playing with lights, shadows, and fog). I'd love to see Jesse implement a "Render to disc" function that works from either the main window or the navigator. That way we can render normal sized images from the smaller navigator window, or render obnoxiously HUGE images from the main window which might otherwise choke the computer if rendered as usual (again - I am not experienced with this area, it's just an idea I saw somebody else float and never saw the reply to) (they just wanted "render to disc" for large renders - my twist was making it work from the Navigator so we can preserve those images we can't reproduce in the main window in higher resolution that just a screenshot!). |
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« Last Edit: March 06, 2011, 11:27:26 AM by Sockratease, Reason: speelinf eroorz »
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Life is complex - It has real and imaginary components. The All New Fractal Forums is now in Public Beta Testing! Visit FractalForums.org and check it out! |
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lenord
Fractal Bachius
Posts: 611
No Matter where you go there you are
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« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2011, 02:47:07 PM » |
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I tried to send the Nav settings back on to the main screen, then I hit the Calculator button...but I didn't get quite the same image I had worked up on the Navigator screen. I fiddled around with the ambient shadow, etc. but it wasn't coming out the same... Why would this happen? I usually see the opposite effect, what I see in the Nav after Importing main screen params aren't the same but that's because I use extreme narrow and extreme wide FoVy much of the time and a lot of hand entered Zooms without adjusting Z-Start/End. FoVy below 10 and over 170 degrees import/export to the Nav as 10 or 170, and inserting Params to the Nav with hand entered zooms the Zstart and zEnd get calculated when exported to the main screen. Make sure the first thing you do after opening the nav is click load each time, just be aware of these things, you'll get used to it, just like driving a car. |
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chaos_crystal
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« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2011, 09:40:52 PM » |
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There is always going to be a big difference between the way things look in the navigator and in the main window. ...
they are different and to get the main window to duplicate exactly what you see in the navigator is not always easy (usually lots of playing with lights, shadows, and fog). Um, yeah, so I've discovered! :  I'd love to see Jesse implement a "Render to disc" function that works from either the main window or the navigator. That way we can render normal sized images from the smaller navigator window, or render obnoxiously HUGE images from the main window which might otherwise choke the computer if rendered as usual (again - I am not experienced with this area, it's just an idea I saw somebody else float and never saw the reply to) (they just wanted "render to disc" for large renders - my twist was making it work from the Navigator so we can preserve those images we can't reproduce in the main window in higher resolution that just a screenshot!). [/quote] Exactly! I just got thru saving to JPG a fairly large main-window fractal which I forgot to put thru Hi_Res, but oh well. (thus saith the Newbie). I noticed that even though a couple of my "test" efforts wound up huge in the main window, apparently they resize themselves, somehow, in the final save, to a smaller and more manage-able size. So far I'm not getting how to control my image size, e.g. if I want to save it to "wall size" it should remain so when rendered and saved to disk. And yes, wouldn't it be great to have a means of saving straight off the Navigator, when you have color and lighting j-u-s-t right and you know you can't reproduce the effect... I could save as a screenshot and tune up the image with my graphic art program, but I'm sure the res would not be quite the same no matter what filters I used. |
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I conceived and developed a new geometry of nature and implemented its use in a number of diverse fields. It describes many of the irregular and fragmented patterns around us, and leads to full-fledged theories, by identifying a family of shapes I call fractals.
— Benoit Mandelbrot
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lenord
Fractal Bachius
Posts: 611
No Matter where you go there you are
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« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2011, 11:11:45 PM » |
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The image width and Height settings determine the Render size, the Scale selection determines the saved image size it also determines Antialiasing. A 2400x1200 full size image saved at 1:1 is untouched- a 2400x1200 image saved at 1:2 is 1200x600 with 2x Antialias, at 1:3 is 800x400 with 3x antialias.
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joeyg007
Forums Freshman
Posts: 12
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« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2011, 05:35:12 PM » |
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It would seem as far as color and lighting and fog goes always use the main window to adjust and always save at 1:1 to get the full size. The Nav window is fast and easy for moving around but sometimes the look and ZOOM level differs from the main window when sending params over. This may be OT but trying to upload an avatar, is there a specific format and size?
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