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Author Topic: Hi, from Scotland, author of Tune Smithy  (Read 2219 times)
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robertinventor
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« on: February 10, 2013, 12:26:26 AM »

Hi there, just to introduce myself, I'm from Scotland, live on the Isle of Mull. I've been involved and interested in fractal music for a long time, ever since I had an idea for  a fractal tune way back in the 1980s before I had a multi-media capable computer to try it out on.

So, I've written this program Tune Smithy and have also just now had the idea (after one of the users of my programs asked if it can make fractal images) to try adding fractal music to fractal animations and especially the 3D fractals. Don't know why I never thought of it before.

This is the result, using videos made by others that I just remixed with audio from Tune Smithy.

This first video is by Torsten Stier accompanied by one of the Tune Smithy fractal tunes - the golden ratio 'cello tune which uses Fibonacci rhythms, interesting rhythms that are highly structured but never repeat exactly so have no fixed measure size at any level.
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/qGpb6JmCANM&rel=1&fs=1&hd=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/qGpb6JmCANM&rel=1&fs=1&hd=1</a>

The whole tune is automatically generated from the short seed you hear played before the tune starts right at the beginning of the clip. It is like making a visual fractal  you adjust the parameters, you can randomize them too if you like, and tweak it until it sounds good smiley.

Playlist of them all:

I haven't made any 3D fractal animations myself. Had a go with Mandelbulber and Mandelbulb, to see how they work, and did wonder about making animations myself but after seeing how much work is involved, and also how long it takes to render a video- you must be pretty dedicated to do them I think smiley. And most of my time is taken up with programming my music software or music related activities.

So, for now anyay I think just use other people's animations, but I greatly enjoy watching these videos and the images you all make.

Also just to repeat what I said in the other thread:

You can use any of the demo tunes for your own work including commercially, and you can also use Tune Smithy to create new fractal music of your own. You don't need to be a composer or to have musical training to use the software, just vary the parameters to create new tunes much like the way you work with visual fractals:
http://robertinventor.com/software/main/acceptable_use.htm

To find out about the fractal tunes and download Tune Smithy see:
http://robertinventor.com/software/tunesmithy/tune_smithying.htm
More fractal tune videos here:
http://robertinventor.com/software/tunesmithy/tune_smithy_videos.htm
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cKleinhuis
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« Reply #1 on: February 10, 2013, 01:22:12 AM »

hello and welcome to the forums, this is an awesome approach, and the first fractal music i ever heard that actually sound like ... sound wink
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« Reply #2 on: February 10, 2013, 01:24:19 AM »

but i need to mention that it may cause problems to just use other peoples videos with new music, better ask beforehand!
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« Reply #3 on: February 10, 2013, 01:32:03 AM »

lols, i am just listening to all the tunes, they miss a base-line somehow, but the symphonic style of them is somehow really calming, amazing!
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robertinventor
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« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2013, 01:33:59 AM »

That's okay, I did ask permission beforehand for the first one. See the comments for the original video here for the discussion

<a href="http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=53981003&amp;server=vimeo.com&amp;fullscreen=1&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=01AAEA" target="_blank">http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=53981003&amp;server=vimeo.com&amp;fullscreen=1&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=01AAEA</a>

That's the source for the video only. I downloaded the video and changed the soundtrack for a Tune Smithy track, and uploaded it and got their permission to release the new mix publicly.

The original video is set to attribution non commercial so it is okay to do non commercial mixes of it, but as a program author for a commercial program it was a bit of a gray area whether I could do it.

However, CHROMETROPIC there said "..as long as the Tune Smithy plug stays secondary to the credits, we're cool. thanks and keep on inventing!" - see the video comments for the rest of it. It's great to have permission to use it like  this smiley.

For the other videos, then they are all by Don Whittaker and are released as creative commons, so anyone is free to remix them so long as you attribute the original author of the video.

but i need to mention that it may cause problems to just use other peoples videos with new music, better ask beforehand!
« Last Edit: February 10, 2013, 01:50:22 AM by robertinventor » Logged
Apophyster
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« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2013, 02:15:08 AM »

I remember seeing Tune Smithy long ago, and probably tried it (on a pIII vintage computer), but I can't recall the experience.
I will have to take another look now that I have faster core i7 cycles to play with.  cheesy

I write the Apophymator script which enables users to create sets of animation frames from individual flames.  The script must be run from Apophysis (3D hack or 7X 15b).
I'm nearing release of a new version of the script but here's what is now available:
http://morphapoph.deviantart.com/art/Apophymator-12-proto-305832263

You are correct, it takes a long time to create the frames and rendering of HD frames with Apophysis using a cpu is pretty much out of the question.

Flame animations are not nearly as appealing to most people as those created with the Mandelbulb, etc, software.
Some people have done some nice flame animations with my script though - my own animations are not very good examples and none of them include a music track.
Here's my main YT page:
http://www.youtube.com/fraxious

I get all confused by the copyright stuff, and don't really know what type of copyright I may have applied to any particular animation.
But you (or any others here) are welcome to use any you'd like.  smiley
I will edit the copyright for any animation if that's necessary, just let me know.

Oh yeah... documentation for the script is appalling, and something I keep hoping to improve but have failed to do as yet.
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robertinventor
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« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2013, 02:45:37 AM »

Just a thought, have any of you tried OpenCL for 3D mandelbulb programming? Was just watching a webcast where someone talked about how they have now ported their entire graphics engine onto the GPU. The GPU seems a natural fit for computing fractals, with its massive parallelism though I've no idea how easy / hard it is to get these computations to run on a GPU smiley.

This is where I read about GPU computing and so found out about OpenCL, just the other day : Engadget Primed: The crazy science of GPU compute

Your flame animations look great, I'll certainly have a go at adding music to some of them, thanks smiley.

BTW coincidentally I just put on a fire on my stove here on Mull. Did it mainly just because it is nice and cheerful to light a fire sometimes in winter, and the house needs to be kept dry especially in winter, as I'm one of those people who hardly feel the cold at all and indeed like it when it's cold, it's actually a few degrees warmer than it was earlier this week but good to have it on every few weeks for a while just to keep the house dry.

You are correct, it takes a long time to create the frames and rendering of HD frames with Apophysis using a cpu is pretty much out of the question.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2013, 03:28:33 AM by robertinventor » Logged
taurus
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« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2013, 06:40:12 AM »

That's okay, I did ask permission beforehand for the first one. See the comments for the original video here for the discussion


I'm pretty sure you asked the wrong one for permission, but that's ok, 'cause you don't need a permission to use this vid. It's a CC license. Just for the sake of completeness, the original of the original is this one

<a href="http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=43170229&amp;server=vimeo.com&amp;fullscreen=1&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=01AAEA" target="_blank">http://vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=43170229&amp;server=vimeo.com&amp;fullscreen=1&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=01AAEA</a>

Quote
have any of you tried OpenCL for 3D mandelbulb programming?

mandelbulber, the program used for this animation, has indeed an experimental implementation for open cl. http://www.fractalforums.com/releases-b233/mandelbulber-1-09-experimental-opencl-support/
Unfortunately Buddhi postboned the open cl development due to compatibility problems. The implementation so far is rudymentary, as it does support only some of the formulas and most effects are disabled.
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robertinventor
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« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2013, 02:38:53 PM »

Oh right, seems so. I see you are the author of the video - great vid! I've updated the youtube information for the ones that use your video, and changed the youtube videos to CC as they should be released under the same license. Thanks for sharing it CC smiley.

Yes, after that post, read a bit more about OpenCL, that it is tough to program in at present, and I found a video somewhere on this site that did use OpenCL. Perhaps this is something that will become easier in the future, as graphics computing gets developed.

I'm pretty sure you asked the wrong one for permission, but that's ok, 'cause you don't need a permission to use this vid. It's a CC license.
...
mandelbulber, the program used for this animation, has indeed an experimental implementation for open cl. http://www.fractalforums.com/releases-b233/mandelbulber-1-09-experimental-opencl-support/
Unfortunately Buddhi postboned the open cl development due to compatibility problems. The implementation so far is rudymentary, as it does support only some of the formulas and most effects are disabled.
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taurus
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« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2013, 11:22:36 PM »

I've updated the youtube information for the ones that use your video, and changed the youtube videos to CC as they should be released under the same license.

Thanks!

The soundtrack you created is really interrestintg. The first fractally generated tune I hear, that is far away from being noise. Sounds a bit like some chineese fusion improvisation (the harp reminds me of a "Pipa" - the chineese guitar if you want). I'm pretty busy at the moment, so trying your program will have to wait. But I'll definitely keep that in mind.
Really nice work! grin
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robertinventor
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« Reply #10 on: February 11, 2013, 05:58:44 AM »

Thanks!

Yes, it's like visual fractals, - well you can play the example tunes right away just as you can try out example fractals - but really getting involved in it and finding out what you can do takes time just like with visual fractals.

That's the Kontakt harp you hear, yes, it does sound rather "Chinesey" can see what you mean. Generally I don't like to use it much because it is supposed to be an orchestral harp, and for that, it doesn't really sound too good to my ears. But for this sort of thing it works fine smiley. I think harps must be particularly hard to do as virtual instruments. There's a long forum discussion about harps here for instance with some examples of ones to try out.

Some time I'd like to try out a few the other ones mentioned there, but at well over $100 per instrument for good well sampled sound sets recordings of top players of the instruments, then it can get expensive. Especially when you want it to sound like acoustic instruments. Sometimes they sound great in the demos but when you buy the instruments they aren't as nice as they seemed to be before you bought the instrument smiley.

Once you've got a good fractal tune, choice of instruments to use for it can make a huge difference, and then also, reverb as well can make quite a difference too sometimes. So there is as much tweaking of it as I am sure there must be tweaking of colours and visual effects in visual fractals.

BTW I am totally amazed by the fractal images and animations on this forum. Don't understand how I have never discovered this place before.

Thanks!

The soundtrack you created is really interrestintg. The first fractally generated tune I hear, that is far away from being noise. Sounds a bit like some chineese fusion improvisation (the harp reminds me of a "Pipa" - the chineese guitar if you want). I'm pretty busy at the moment, so trying your program will have to wait. But I'll definitely keep that in mind.
Really nice work! grin
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