Welcome to Fractal Forums

I deleted one of my fractals from DA, and got a question as to why I deleted it.  I  made a long statement about their horrid simplification of fractals being only fractals if they are generated by fractal generating programs!  (repetition on purpose)

So I got down and put my head to the books and started a huge essay on what fractals are.....  well my friend told me to calm down.  He said they have every right to define it in such narrow views and that I could lose my account.

Well, I haven't lost it yet and I'm trying to talk to an admin now, waiting on a response.   So I made a very simple fractal by hand to prove even my somewhat poor drawing skills can render a fractal. (http://th05.deviantart.net/fs71/PRE/f/2010/193/8/b/Hand_Drawn_Fractal_by_Thunder_Wave.png)

I then tried to search for other similar fractals like this to prove other places have called this a fractal, but I couldn't find one.  Curious if anyone knows a fractal out there like this.

For every line divide it equally in half by itself at half the size.  I am no math-wizard but I get the process.  :)

Anyways, hello all! :evil1:

BTW, my fractals are mostly made by Photoshop, Apophysis, and Oxidizer.  I also am working on fractal music.

Hi, Thunderwave.

 I haven't seen that particular fractal before, but I would say it's definately as much a fractal as the Koch snowflake or any other IFS. I've never heard anyone claim that the only real fractals are computer-generated fractals before.

Very good!!
Welcome to the paradise of fractals!*
*fractalforums.com
O0

Hi and welcome to the forums! :)

This post reminds me my first post here on FF :

http://www.fractalforums.com/meet-and-greet/have-you-seen-this-fractal/msg6083/

Hello and Welcome to the forums!

My first reaction to those stating that fractals must come from a computer program is to inquire about fern trees, nautilus shells, and riverways found in Nature!  All follow fractal patterns, but better not have come from a computer program - or else my entire view of the Universe Itself is in serious jeopardy!!

I have a Chaoscope fractal someplace that resembles your drawing - I'll try to dig it out after I get home from my employment...

Thanks all, :D I should post the link about this issue of "non-fractals" from DA, http://news.deviantart.com/article/69703/ (http://news.deviantart.com/article/69703/).
Also my replies/comments are by Thunder-Wave.

I am curious who here generates fractals from "non-fractal" computer programs like Photoshop?
(http://th05.deviantart.net/fs70/150/i/2010/163/0/7/Eye_of_the_Rainbow_by_Thunder_Wave.jpg)
This one was made with Bryce 6 and Mirrors.
(http://th02.deviantart.net/fs71/150/i/2010/136/4/f/DXI_by_Thunder_Wave.png)

Thank for the info... I promptly resigned from their site.
Pretentious dorks... I'll find a place somewhere else where things are appreciated.  :fiery:

What, like here maybe?

The categories at DA are based on how the image was created rather than what the image is i.e. if created using traditional drawing or painting is one category, general digital art is another, photos another, photomanip another, fractals another.
So they consider anything hand-drawn or painted as belonging to that category even if it is a fractal.
As for fractals created by fractal plug-ins for Photoshop or PSP, I think there are already many that have been allowed in the fractal category and if you make the point that such were created using fractal plug-ins (in whatever software) I don't think DA wold have a problem with them going in the fractal category.
Obviously under this system photos of real-world fractals go in the photography category.

Ahhh, I see David, but this style of sorting is completely unfavorable to those obsessed with fractals beyond software. lol
I sure hope I didn't promote resigning, Klixon. :(  Please, understand I appreciate DA for what they're worth.   All I ask them to say, is:  "We only accept fractals made with digital software intended to make fractals." and I will leave them alone. 

P.S. I don't know of any fractal plugins for PS, or Bryce.  I use actions in PS and reflections in Bryce to create fractals.  Both of which is time consuming and very meditative as well.  Bryce though takes forever to render.... Ooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmm.....

I have used the Fractalius plugin for photoshop. It can be found here

http://www.redfieldplugins.com/filterFractalius.htm

It gives practically any image fractal like qualities.

I find the plug-in very easy and straightforward to use.
(i did not do these - these are from the website)
(http://psychedelictrip.org/wp-content/uploads/FractalSanta01L.jpg) (http://psychedelictrip.org/wp-content/uploads/FractalLion01L.jpg)
(http://psychedelictrip.org/wp-content/uploads/Fractal03L.jpg)(http://psychedelictrip.org/wp-content/uploads/Fractal01L.jpg)
but photoshop costs so much money....
If only there was a plug-in like this for gimp. Now that would be cool!!!

There may also be fractal plug-ins for paint.net I haven't looked recently.

 :sad1: Fractalius is only available for windows....  I got PS2 for cheap as a student discount.  When I go back to college, I will get a new PC (Mac) with the latest Adobe suite.

[soapbox-moment]BTW, to all that do not know, PC does NOT stand for Windows! (stupid comercials)  :fiery: And why does adobe make so many packages?  Why can't I just buy the ones I want at a similar price? :hmh:[/soapbox-moment]

Don't be absurd! All these creative minds are a menace to society. The FBI will be on me in minutes  :scared:

PS (I'm in the final stage of finally rendering a zoom into the mandelbrot set. I still have to find legal and decent music to acompany it, though, so dont hold yer breath just yet lol)

Dont worry, mate... My actions are my own. I just find that whole article a disgrace.
Fractals are not defined by the software with which they're created.

I see a point in David's comment about categorizing, but the way it is discussed disgusts me.

You shouldn't judge DA by the DA staff or the rather more vocal members, there's actually a very good fractal community there.
Anyway if you want another alternative then Renderosity also has a good fractal membership.

Have you read the article and comments? (seriously!)
Thanks for the tip on renderosity, i will check it out. ;)

Join up to http://vimeo.com and do a shout out in the forums - specifically the "wanted and offered" forum!!! Its a hot melting pot of artists collaborating together - I get free music from there all the time there is some real talent there!! O0

http://vimeo.com/forum:wanted_and_offered

An unexpected thank you from me for this link.  I write music and would love people to use it in movies and stuff.  Thanks.

P.S. I agree with both David and Klixon!  :)
The article is a disgrace but is not the thoughts of all DA staff, especially since most there probably don't know or have the time to monitor all moderators.

I also plan to check out renderosity.  I've heard of them.

ahh - I do love it when a plan comes together - collaborations a plenty.... ;D ;D ;D

Definitions of fractals don't mention anything about computers or algorithms they usually have more to do with statements involving geometric measure theory and self similar sets.

Your fractal was generated through applying the same force repeatedly (not the same mathematical function as the computer fractals), that is your hand drawing the fractal.

That is the only difference I really see as far as generating a fractal.

Computer fractals aren't iterated infinitely (only if you had infinite time could you have infinite subdivision), just as your fractal doesn't have infinite detail.

It seems as if they're merely categorizing art works between those created by traditional methods and those created digitally.

It's a valid distinction in categorizing art but not about defining what a fractal is or whether the object is fractal art.

Thanks! Will check it out soon


True. I'll probably be reading/viewing works from others there. But the smugness in the article and comments is something I just can't stand. Do not want...


Interesting... I'll be checking out your site tomorrow. Always nice to hear new music, and hopefully it fits well with my zoom :)

Thanks Klixon!

I excitedly await your thoughts!   ^-^

I finally found it!

Actually, it's not the one I was looking for  (that one has double the "arms" but is otherwise very similar).

Here it is (a Chaoscope Julia Fractal):

(http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m278/sockratease/station.jpg)

If I ever find the other, I'll post it too.

Fascinating!  Thank you Sockratease,  I'm excited to see the other one as well.

I fell asleep last night before i could check out your music :embarrass:

I'm listening now. And I am thoroughly impressed! Beautiful works.
I'm definitely going back for another listening session tomorrow. I'm too tired to fully appreciate it at the moment, and I already found some pieces I need to listen to more then once to "get" them. Just what i look for in music.

favourites so far: Black Widow and abandondedmemories

Are those recordings made in a studio or a theatre?
And how much time did it take to get crystalglass right? That is just awesome :D

"Black Widow" was made in a Concert Hall by the "St. Helens String Quartet", "Abandoned Memories" was made in my own studio.  It was a piano improvisation that has added effects for 'mysterious encounters'!  ;)


Thanks so much! I would say that was a b^#%!  But it was fun.  It's not equally tempered so measuring water to tune, took forever; and playing each glass to get the effect, took lots of practice and the recording was never just right.  If you're curious, it's tuned to a septimal harmonic scale, I can tell you more later.

Well, it turns out that there's a new moderator for the Fractal Gallery.  She is going to write up  a new article about fractals and why the gallery only accepts Digital software programs dedicated to making fractals.  She may take it up a level to allow all computer generated fractals, but she doubts they will allow hand drawn ones or any non-digital fractal.

I am still talking with her to try to make things better.

I will suggest that they consider fractals its own category and make branches for digital to non-digital fractals.  Plus I suggested to add questions as to how the fractal was designed, generated, or developed, like from a fractal program or a process of another kind.  That should somewhat clarify if they are fractals or not.

She agreed with my description of Fractals and defended the article by saying he was only explaining the category, not fractals.  Even if that is what he meant the article didn't explain that.

Nonetheless,  things are looking up for dA Fractals. :)

I wonder what they'd make of things like this over at Deviant Art:

(http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m278/sockratease/slices.png)

It *was* made with a Fractal Generator!

Feel free to link to it (or any other such Fractals I made from Lissa's Images)  (There are MANY posted around the forum)  (I get Obsessive!).

Should be good for a laugh if nothing else.  And prove the point that Fractals are not so easily defined as one may think...

If it follows the rules Mandelbrot mentioned in his book "The Fractal Geometry of Nature", than it is a fractal.

@sock

the lissa image above is a complex projection, and not really a fracal :)

Not even if I wish Really Hard?  :angry:

Hi gang;

My name's Richard and I just came across this thread regarding PS fractal plugins. I have, over the past year, become very interested in Fractal imagery and coded a fractal generator called Fractus that is a PS plugin. You can find it here: http://www.richardrosenman.com/project/?cid=212 Take a look through the gallery to see samples.

More importantly, the Mandelbrot set guided me into the Buddhabrot fractal and I have just coded a very nice PS filter that generates complex ones as well. I have not launched the filter publicly yet (will do so by the end of the week), but you guys can check out the gallery and info in the meantime if you're interested: http://www.richardrosenman.com/project/?cid=224

I have a third one based on Diffusion Limited Aggregation but I need to finish that one up.

There are many advantages in coding a plugin embedded in PS as opposed to a stand-alone since you can focus on the good stuff and let PS take carry of the redundant things like color management, loading, saving, etc. The problem with my plugins (and many still for PS) is that they're all currently making the switch over to 64bit and therefore are still limited by size (memory). Once I get a 64bit version out, size won't be the limitation that it is now.

I am insanely impressed with the Mandelbulb images I've seen but unfortunately they are beyond my programming abilities.

Read the rest of this post about DA and it's disappointing to say the least.

Anyway, it's great to meet everyone here and I'm looking forward to discovering many more beautiful fractals...

(http://richardrosenman.com/gallery/photo/4c4e5417160ac.jpg)

Cheers,
-Rich

I love this and will investigate to learn more.
Please vote here http://dragonwinter.deviantart.com/journal/poll/1354655/ a deviantArt Fractal Gallery Poll by the fractal moderator,
to comment and help make a change.

Remember the Hand Drawn Fractal?

Here it is with Photoshop actions:
(http://www.fractalforums.com/gallery/3/2367_30_07_10_2_02_35.jpeg)

Here it is with Apophysis:
(http://www.fractalforums.com/gallery/3/2367_30_07_10_3_10_59.jpeg)

I'm working to make a 3D one but am still unfamiliar with its workings, (mandelbulb 3D).

have done some photoshop programming,
isent that hard.....
When i cranked up my fractal skillz i can do you a filter or whatnot if you want ;)

occasionally I make one in paint, here's one which I made to have some weird properties (I think)...
Its dust like the cantor set, has no area, the largest piece would be infinitely small, every two points will have a gap between them, but wouldn't fall apart either, but never-the-less would have infinite stretch. :ugly:

Actually, I love generating fractals this way.  I get more control out of it and the actions are easy to edit if it comes out boring.
I already downloaded some Photshop filters from some links on this site, but they only work for Windows, I have a Mac.
I enjoy all kinds of fractal generators so if there are any for Mac I will download it, especially if it's free.  I'm poor. :(


That is awesome.  I love it! :D

instead of breaking things into programs I save components as separate files for reuse I am able to force symmetry by removing one half copying the remaining half flipping it than merging the two half's

I love free transform fractals you can make anything you like as long as it's 2d but it also allows for z depth for pseudo 3d     

There are many fractal applications for the MAC, and several of them are FREE.  There are also many filters and plugins available for the MAC to use with PhotoShop (or other such graphic programs).

Have you tried Fracton ??  It is a rather new fractal renderer, and being developed on a weekly basis:
    http://www.fracton.org/ (http://www.fracton.org/)

Many more where that came from.     :dink:
 

Thanks Nahee, I have tried that one and it wont work on my old Mac.
I should update what I have:
I realize now that because my Mac is before Intel, any fractal programs for the modern Macs wont work.
I love Macs but, now I got a Windows 7 64 bit pc.  I plan to keep my Mac as I still use it even though I have a faster pc.
I realize some fractal programs don't run on 64 bit and I don't have Photoshop for Windows.  I have found some here that work.

I like trying every fractal software out there, so any suggestions is a big :D thank you.  I also google any of them brought up here.

If you would give exact details of your MAC OS, then it would make it a lot easier for people to assist you.  Complaining about not being able to find software, but not explaining the parameters in which you search for such things, makes it very difficult to give you help.


Why would anyone pay such an outrageous fee for Adobe's Photoshop, when they can download the GIMP (http://www.gimp.org/) for FREE and do just about everything (if not more) that Photoshop can??  (Not to mention also having IrfanView (http://www.irfanview.com/), Paint.NET, etc....)

I know of over 600 fractal applications, and I can get the majority to run on my 64-bit Windows system.  But then again, I know how to use software, utilities and much more.  I can even run old legacy DOS programs on my 64-bit system.  Ever hear of DOS-Box ??
 

I have a Mac OSX 10.4 PowerPC PowerBook G4 laptop.
BTW, I love Oxidizer, although they don't support PowerPC anymore. I Have Xaos now as well which is fun.
Hmmm, let me see what else I have on here.  Apophysis j (Not as good as the Windows 7 version), Context Free (a fun program to do recursion of patterns), Gimp (I forgot I downloaded that), Quadrium set (Demos Only).  I don't have any 3D ones, know of any that support PowerPC? 

I got a good discount on it for school, otherwise I wouldn't have gotten it.  It was the whole Adobe Suite CS2 (Not sure what package but I got Macromedia with it as well).  I have enjoyed it but I won't pay the whole price to upgrade it.  Instead I use free stuff on Windows 7 and Mac Tiger. 

I just downloaded Paint.net for win7-64 and it has fractals that I have yet to explore. 

WOW 600! :verysurprised:

I had downloaded DOS-Box for Mac once.  I forgot I had it.  I think Fractint is a DOS program

List of Programs I now have for Win7:
I have Jesse's 3D program that works great on Win 7. 
May I ask if you have Mandelbulber working on Win 7 64?  I couldn't get it to work. 
UF (Demo)
Fractal eXtreme Demo
Fractal Explorer
ChaosPro

Thanks Nahee!  Sorry if I complained too much.  I never meant to whine, just talk.  I did forget that Macs went intel.

I like Gimp, it is good, but it doesn't compete with Photoshop, and FIW you can get it for quite cheap if you hunt a bit on eBay for a second hand old version, paid a couple of pounds for the full version of version 5 and later bought an entire boxed Adobe Design Suite including Photoshop 7, Illustrator 10,  Acrobat Pro 6 and  Indesign 2 for an amazing £20 including postage...

Hello I am Sander Kloppenburg.

HOW did you get into fractal art?
Well a while back I discovered the wonderful world of fractals via a good friend. She made some movies with it and so did I.
The first fractal I am really proud of was this one:
(http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/3295/kloppenbug.gif)
I animated it as if it is some kind of fish and made it loop forever. I like giving fractals a life of their own and my goal is to make an animation in a fractal-world mix it with real footage of cymatics
(http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/6114/cymatic.gif)
and oil in ecoline mixed with water in a oven-dish on top of my overhead projector.


WHEN did you?
I guess since I was 18 which was 6 years ago, so since 2004.

WHAT is your education?  IE formal & or self taught!
self taught. Although I am graduated as a Master in Computer Animation and Visual Effects.

GOALS what do you want to use these skills for?
Make a world of my own. Not just with fractals but with a lot of weird fractal-like natural events as well.
Here is an exemple of mixing real footage (sirop in water) with 3d animation.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4R_DbXA0U1g